This message board is dedicated to the gal in the mailroom of the "Dream Building".She's doing such a good job there she may never be moved up.At least not until she has trained a suitable replacement!
Monadh-I hope you don't mind my initiative in this matter.I am not bucking for your job- I,m quite happy licking stamps.*s*
Welcome one and all - can I get you a cup of coffee? lol
Ivy

Oh thank you so much Ivy..I wasn't sure if I would have the courage to actually carry this out..and now I see you have already done it for me..and us all...thanks a bundle..(bundle of envelopes that is..still have to be sorted..yikes I better get to work here! Have you seen the paper clips? *L*) Please..everyone.. feel free to dream your dreams, sing your songs, dance your way through the storm. Many welcomes to the 'newly renovated dream journal'..to some it may seem merely pages in a book..but if you just look closely enough..you shall find there are worlds within worlds....Dreams within dreams....(plus your choice of tea or coffee, biscuits or muffins..it's all included in the package)...To your left you will notice the new sofa set..(Please no Sigmund Freud jokes..*L* Now..lets get this show on the road! *s*...~ZZZZzzzzzZZZzzzZZZ~

Thought I would copy&paste this from the last page, because I found it to be so breatakingly beautiful.I hope the author doesn't mind me reposting this..I just couldn't help myself*S*.~

As I closed my eyes, the deck began to roll beneath my feet. The moonless sea looked eerie by the light from a thousand suns sparkling like jewels in the heavens so far away. My eyes on the compass, my sextant reading sure. Stearing a course for those rocky cliffs that hide the safe harbor where the one I seek lives above in the warm cottage by the sea. Only a day and night's sail away now. Soon I'll once again be in the arms of the only one I ever loved. Waiting for me in the warm cottage on the cliffs by the sea...

The Buccaneer

... Sunrise is almost upon my ship, the horizon is crimson red, a following sea and the wind at my back bring new hope for this glorious day. I gaze at the morning star bright in the heavens, my lover's face lights up my way, by sunset I'll be in her arms once again and stay with her many a day. We'll walk in the sun and dance in the moonlight, and make love til the sun's up again. We'll stay in her cottage, up high on the cliffs, with solid ground under our feet, with a warm fire burning as our passion is turning to fire, blazing towards the sky. And my crew will goad me to head off, to the distant shores there to plunder, but I'll send them away and stay with my love, with the stars up above and us under...

The Buccaneer

A journey of the heart *S* I have been having the most pleasant dreams the past few days..I wonder what sign the moon is in? ~zzzZZZzzz~

Last night I dreamed of fires burning in the snow..it was a rather calm state of dream, it is very hard to recall..mostly just the feeling is left, but as far as imagery..fires burning on snowy peaks...but there was so much else happening, and that was merely one of the dreams I had last night...Anyone else find that some dreams just tend to run from one into the other..and what is there to divide them anyway? Could it be a moment of non dreaming within dreaming...Have any of you noticed the exact moment in which you fall asleep?..it is such a perfect feeling...for me it is like being on a wave..or freely falling..soaring into the depths of a dreamworld. Oh Buccaneer..you write so wonderfully....Pray, lend me your gift of words that I might write as well as thee .Sweet dreams , a chairde....zzzZZZzzzZzzZZ

Since I have had my computer, windows have started popping up in my dreams...and I can get from place to place and communicate with one or another person thru them. And if I have a problem I can hit someones website and go to technical help to try and rectify things...hmmm! Do you think I'm spending just a little bit too much time on puter???? *LOL*

Okay in my dreams last night I was in a grocery store..checking out at the till, I was with two other people that I have known for a long time, and we were making small talk with the cashier..when she turns to me and said..Oh by the way congratulations..and I asked for what am I being congratulated? And she said..for your return back from (??????Name of some other planet)At which point in my dream I suddenly recall the journey I have just returned from..the mission I was on..etc...I thank her and we leave the store..dream fades into us now driving all over town (some town I am not sure where)looking..seeking to find, this house where we are supposed to build a greenhouse..ahh..it was such a messy dream state..from one phase to the other..it was all a bunch of garble it would seem..but somewhere amidst it all I dreamed I was in France,(or at least it seemd to be )I was at the site of a great pilgrimage, there were thousands of people in the crowds..in tents and beautiful clothing..It all seemed like many ages ago..I seemed to view this dream as though not from in this life, but whomever I am in this dream, almost completely unaware of my actual living being..I was utterly consumed by this dream. This location caused my blood to stir, my heart to quake..my very breath to move..it was a holy site of wonder...it all felt miraculous..All these tents and people dressed in such fine fabrics..and this glorious site which was a long and circular castle wall..a wall that seemed to stretch out forever in a straight line, yet return to itself at the beginning. And why did when I rest my palms upon the stones, and run them along this wall as I walk..why did it feel so sacred a wall? And what was this music that seemed to flow from everyones lips? And as I walked I noticed I was encircling this castle, no matter how long it would take..but time seemed to hold no meaning..and the people with whom I walked seemed, as I , not to feel the weight of time, nor the wounds that suffered upon our feet..we were filled with the spirit of life and guided onwards with every step. And as we came to the beginning and end of our journey, I noticed the ones who were ahead of us, and the candles which they were holding, and the dress they wore seemed to signify their stature..and I felt the deepest of respect and love for them and realized that it was them whom we followed and they who us led. It was such a beautiful dream I dare say no words of mine could ever fully describe...~zzZZZZzzzZZZzz~

*L*..just read your post Leda..I can't believe this... it's hilarious..I was wondering if that had been happening to anyone else besides me..In my dreams over the last while I have suddenly realized I can link from one section to the next, ..I think Windows have invaded the dreamworld somehow! *L* (shudder to think...) I wonder in what directions and to what extent, the study and experience of dreams will be taken..What new technologies await us in the future which will somehow harnass our dreams,..allow us to manipulate..and design..Scary thought..But still I cannot help but wonder...I wonder what peoples dreams were like a thousand years ago..and further even,,..I wonder how dreams have evolved through the ages..Who could ever say? Is there even to be classified a common dream ?

The hand in the crows nest sings out the words,
That I've longed to hear all these weeks,
Land ho, land ho off the starboard bow,
The land where's the love that I seek.
Soon the anchor will weigh in the dark hidden harbor,
Below the cliffs where my love lives above
I'll run up the path, that leads to her cottage
Across the meadow to the arms that I love
The arms I've wanted to be in since I left them
And we'll dance and we'll sing as we run to the cottage,
With thoughts of love and passion made real
And the rest of this story will be a deep mystery,
For to tell would wrong, don't you feel?

The Buccaneer

I often will have a long extensive dream, but when I awaken, I find that I've only been asleep for mere seconds. In many of these dreams I am with a person who is about to die, or has just died. One such case, I was with a man who had been shot while sitting in his car on a deadend road overlooking a cliff with farm fields below. The policeman who had ben the first on the scene was rather nervous, and as the recently departed man pointed out to me, the tire tracks drove over foot prints of the officer. The car was a old but in good shape blue car with a black ragtop on it. Nobody including the officer in question noticed the foot print with the tire track over it. The departed man was certain that the policeman had done him in retaliation for something dealing with either a woamn or something that both men wanted but the dead man had obtained. Any takers on this one?

Dreams which seem to last forever..and then you awake to find you have only been sleeping for a relatively few short moments...I find that dreams of this nature can be some of the deepest and most profound..I have heard it said that the average dream lasts about fifteen minutes..and that on average we have no more than two or three of these in a night!!! I find that sooooo hard to believe because (first of all)I have had dreams which I know for a fact lasted a few hours..and (second of all) I have had dreams which lasted only about five minutes...some of my most 'straight and to the point' dreams occur in such cases...One thing I find amazing is how..if when you are sleeping..you hear music in your dream..or someones voice..(music or sounds that are actually occuring in the land of 'the awake')and they becomes incorporated into your dream...It is interesting to look at the effects which our surroundings play in our dreamstate... Now as far as your dream Daryl...sounds amazing..quite the scene you laid out there for us to view...(It honestly sounds like it would be great material for a novel)...As far as meanings go..hard to say really...cliff, field, dead/almost dead person/spirit, man in an authoratative position, and this car with the tracks....and it seems as though a lot is trying to be conceiled...and at the same time revealed...okay so I am definetly showing my lack of expertise here..but I would say the cliff is symbolical of something coming to an end, a conclusion, ..a death in some ways..(but that is not always the case..could have a different meaning altogether actually)the fields below are the things which we long for..hope will come to fruition, materialize etc..(of course..whether the fields were in a state of growth, or laying fallow also has it's particular meaning...)Now a cliff looking over fields also would suggest that eventhough there is something drawing to an end..there is something else that awaits...I could go on and on about what I might see into this dream of yours..but I do not wish to delve into attempting to translate someone else's dreams..I think I would only make things confusing *L* I greatly respect anyone who can right out say : This means this...or That means that..I find it too hard to do this..I think the our dreams in a lot of ways hold doors only we can open...and perhaps the only place to look for answers really is within our own souls...I could be way off base with what I said earlier about the cliff and the fields..I know that for every dream..there is a different translation..well..I tried anyway *s* any other takers? *L*..welcome to our dreamland Daryl *s*....now as far as The Buccaneer's post...*S*.......see ya in my dreams...~zzzZZZzzZzzZzZzz~

My lover and me
Spend days by the sea
And there's seldom a moment alone
As we gaze very deep
While we never do sleep
Deep into each other's eyes
And the love that we feel is exciting
And passionate, sacred and true
And we've loved each other ten lifetimes
Plus a hundred and fifty and two
We hold hands up high in the meadow
While my ship rides high on the tide
And we kiss as the gulls fly over the hills
With the sound of the waves on the shore
And the kiss lasts forever or longer
As the passion carries away
Our souls as they become one together
And we love forever and a day...

The Buccaneer

Monadh!Great dream interpretation.(regarding Daryls' Film Noirish submission).
There is all of
that and -this- Could be Daryl was THERE too.
drawn, as it were, to an event as a witness - as a student-in the dream, are we called/respond to certain harmonics?
Daryl,it is important somehow that in these vivid dreams you accompany a soon to die or already dead person.Why that song Daryl? and why not?
Leda,You can use your dream windows!Spectacular!
Hope you open up one for me *S* I havn't dreamed in a long while...........
sweet snoozees all...
Ivy

Ivy,
I am drawn into these dreams. Sometimes they happen in middle of the day. I call them dreams, but I do not think them just that. When I was younger I used to think I was re-living past lives, but too many of them happen in the present. (or at least during this life time.) When my Grandmother was dying, I was often drawn into dreams about going fishing with her. we caught our fill of large black fish, but we always let them go.
In reality, she would tell my parents that she and I had been fishing. I live almost a 1000 kilometers away from her. It was only through this experience, that I came to realize that these dreams were maybe not just dreams. Most of them are similar, either it involves the circumstances of the person's death or I am talking with the individual on the shores of a dark sea, or a dark road. Lights can be seen on the other side that the person claims to be people that they know. To me, however, they are simply lights. These people usually are not ready to go across the sea in a waiting boat, or across the road. I listen to them until they decide to go across. Most have interesting stories to tell, some of which I use in my poetry. I ask permission before I do, most agree and are glad that their story will be told even if poetic license is used in the telling.
Anyway, The death scene that I related before bothered me tremendously. This was the first one I ever had that was from a murder victim. It occurred about two months ago. I wrote down everything that I saw immediately after, including the color of the various grasses and dirt. If anyone is interested in hearing the entire recorded version of the dream, I will find it and send it to you verbatim.

The candles burn down
And the embers grow dim
As the flames of our passions
Light the dark night within
And the warmth that's between us
Make our cottage so bright
As I hold you so closely
And touch your silk skin
Your kisses so sweet
Make the world go away
And the longer you love me
The longer I'll stay
There's no one that I love
More than I love you
And no love that will ever
Ever be as true

The Buccaneer

stacado rythims
make me twirl across the stage
the dance shows my heart.

BY:Me

Ivy..good point..*s* Daryl..sounds like you have a lot of insights to share...I find it amazing how people (sometimes without even realizing..or rather most times..)can tap into this flowing stream of awareness..I believe that the power to see and to feel is in all of us..it is only a matter of tuning in..being receptive to things which we most oft' would shy from. Buccaneer...you continue to impress me with your sweet gift of prose..*s*..and Gypsywench..wonderful little dittie there..so much movement and expression in such few short words..wonderful haiku fashion... Perhaps I shall share with y'all now a 'poem' I wrote the other night..emm..morning..while on the verge of Zzz's..from my pen ..to your eyes...here goes..-

~'What am I', said the wind...
Is it that I am without form,
And freely move with such force,
And motion...
What makes one
Listen
Listen to the distant
Echoes fading,
As we travel onwards,
Onwards without knowing,
Onwards seeking. ~

Okay..so here is another as well which I wrote last night~

~And the song is:
Come hither
Sweet love,
Come hither nigh my side,
And
Away with me
For it is to the stars
We are going,
Away to the moon
Across those tides..
And it is heaven's breath
Which guides us on.~

Now I must haste to sleep...may all your dreams be filled with poetry in motion, a chairde~ zzzZZZzzz's

One night, I dreamed I was a bird that had fallen out of a tree...

She picked the bird up
With the wounded wing
Set a splint and fed him that night
And she opened the door
To the gilded cage
A place he could sleep without fright
He healed and got better and began to fly about
The cage she intended to keep him
For his feathers were brilliant
And colorful and bright
Much different from her world
Black and white
He sang his sweet song day after day
As his body continued to heal
Then he realized his plight
He was trapped
No long flight
Could he take to get out of his jail
He told her he wanted
To leave and be free
But she couldn't, she wouldn't
Give him freedom
So his feathers they withered
And became pale and gray
His despair was quite painful
You'd say
Outside the rain fell
His life a real hell
And he longed and he wished
And he saddened
Then she blamed him for looking
So forlorn and so tattered
You must bring back
The colors I love
Then one day after feeding
He was very sorely needing
To get out and fly far away
He went to the door
And pushed, it was open
He fell to the floor
Free at last
But his wings would not work
Could not fly away
To his freedom
So he walkled out the house
Quiet as a mouse
To keep her from catching him there
The door was ajar
But he didn't get far
When he heard her starting to cry
My bird's got away
How shall I face the day
Without seeing him there in his cage?
But he didn't look back
As he got off the track
And into the bushes he went
'Til his wings were okay
And he flew straight away
Never to be captured again

But what became of the girl?


The Prisoner

Are not we all held captive to something ?

yes we are. it's called life.:)

We're all held captive by life temporarily, but some have their lives held captive by something or someone that they don't want to be and believe themselves powerless to escape.

The Prisoner

is this real or a dream? that is the queston.

The dreamer is dreaming of his freedom...

My dreams have all been a'blur after waking for the past bit.....but whilst I am dreaming them, they are vivid and clear, of other times and places.. My dream the other night was in the forest, a deep woods I was passing through. And everwhere I looked I found creatures shying in the shadows... *wanders off muttering the words..'To be or not to be'...THAT is the question....* *L*

Hand in hand
We walk on the strand
My beautiful lover and me
We gaze at each other
And we kiss when we can
My lover and me by the sea

The Buccaneer

Under the light
Of the bright western star
My lover and I both look
She in her meadow
And me on the deck
Of my ship
As I sail
Far from her brook
The star is our
Common point
Where our souls
Come together
Joined by love
More intense than the sea
And quite soon
We will be
Holding each other tight
My love and me forever
True and free

The Buccaneer

Were it not for dreams, poetry would not exist.

Wonderfully stated Daryl....
Buccaneer..what can I say..beautiful poetry...*s*
My dreams the past while..so hard to pin down....last night I was travelling on a boat on a river..or was I in a fiord...I seem to remember there being whales in the water...or were they dolphins..seals perhaps even....Such journeys I have been on...old and new lands...I was dreaming of Khatmandu again recently...hadn't dreamed of there in a few years...Dreams and Poetry...they are both conversations with the soul..*zzzzzZZzzZzzZZZZzz*

Cruising two hours
Before the red dawn
I follow the wake of Poseiden
I look to the south
For my companion, fair Scorpius
She rides a little higher
Each morn
Her lights are the emeralds
Of my lover's green eyes
Antares, red star
Like my heart filled with love
Turns this old salty dog
To a boy once again
In love for the very first time

Sunrise

Softly the waves will ripple,
Gently the seabirds crow,
Quietly the sailor rows,
In the morning glow.

The sun will soon be rising,
For night has faded away,
So say good bye to morning,
And say hello to day.

This is a simple morning,
When the sun just seems to smile,
But also a piece of beauty,
From the Emerald Isle.

Roisin Murphy 1997

He Wishes For the Cloths of Heaven.

Had I the heavens' embroidered cloths,
Enwrought with gold and silver light,
The blue and the dim and the dark clothes
of night and light and the half-light,
I would spread the clothes under your feet:
But I, being poor, have only my dreams;
I have spread my dreams under your feet;
Tread softly because you tread on my dreams.

W.B. Yeats (1865-1939)

SONG FOR IRELAND

Walking all the day
Near tall towers where falcons build their nests
Silver-winged they fly
They know the call of freedom in their breasts
Saw Black Head against the sky
Where twisted rocks they run to the sea


Drinking all the day
In old pubs where fiddlers love to play
Saw one touch the bow
He played a reel which seemed so grand and gay
Stood on Dingle Beach and cast
In wild foam we found Atlantic bass


Talking all the day
With true friends who try to make you stay
Telling jokes and news
Singing songs to pass the time away
Watched the Galway salmon run
Like silver dancing, darting in the sun


Dreaming in the night
I saw a land where no one had to fight
Waking in your dawn
I saw you crying in the morning light
Sleeping where the falcons fly
They twist and turn all in your air-blue sky

Living on your western shore
Saw summer sunsets, asked for more
I stood by your Atlantic Sea
And sang a song for Ireland

(Written by Phil and June Colclough)

Oh how I do love poetry y'all! *s*
I'm still wandering around in my dreams....no longer wandering through Kathmandu..I find myself in places closer to home, sometime in the future it seems....all kinda blurry..almost feels like another lifetime *L* Okay well..obviously I need to get some more sleep. ZZzzzZzZzZz*

has anyone here ever felt that they have seen a past life in their dreams,or am i the only one?

I think you might be the only one, g'wench.

Countless ..past and future lifetimes g'wench..
(following lacie's lead on that one)ZZZZzzzZZZZzzzzZZZZ*

Gypsywench check out the book : Past Lives, Present Dreams : How to Use Reincarnation for Personal Growth
by Denise Linn

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/034540002X/ref=sim_books/104-9661392-1161510

thanks i'll check it out Caoilte.

The most troubling thing is when you dream of yourself somewhat older than you are, and you are facing your own death. You wake up trying to tell yourself that it was a past life you dreamt of, but it could always be the future. Perhaps as is often the case with me, it may not even be your life/death at all, but rather someone elses. The Zen Buddist's dream paradox comes to mind.

if it is not my life then why does the girl act just like me. no there are my past lives i know it. the first dream always starts when i'm 5(in the dream) and end when i die. i marry have kids(sometimes), live a normal life, then die. then in this life i met all the people i knew back then.

I lay in my cabin
Sleep comes over me
I dream of my love
In her cottage
High atop the cliff
Warm in her chair
There by the fire
Wishing me by her side
There's trouble in the meadow
Outside of her house
The wolf is below
She's safe inside
But cannot go out
He comes and he goes
And she must be careful
That she doesn't come
Under his wrath
I must sail to her
Cross the sea and dispatch
The wolf so he
NEVER comes back
The time draws near
When the sea cannot claim me
Without my love by my side
We'll sail round the world
The seven wide seas
And we'll marvel
At what we find there
The most beautiful pearls
She'll wear in her hair
And the emeralds
No rival for her
Lovely green eyes
And I'll gaze in her beautiful
Face as I kiss her
Making the world fade away
Where nothing exists
But our love
Close together
Side by side
Her and me
Forever

Crazy Dreams (Paul Brady)

Snow-bound siren in the winter dawn
There's a blizzard blowing in from off the river
It's ten below out on these city streets,
But the feeling in your heart is even colder
The sunrise screeching down the line
And the fog banks running out of time,
But you won't be here when they creep in tomorrow

You're tired of dreaming someone else's dreams
When they really don't include you any longer
Miles from home, you're sliding down with each day
And you need a woman's love to make you stronger
And lately you've been getting doubts
A voice inside keeps calling out
That someone else's dreams don't get you nowhere.

So shut the suitcase, kiss the year goodbye
Don't let nobody stop you at the doorway
And close the shutters on this empty room
Where these crazy dreams come crawling to devour you
And head on out across that line
Where she's been waiting all this time
And tell her that you want her there forever.

It's still two hours till this plane gets down
Can hardly bear to wait another minute
Your sweet loving babe is all that I need
Darling it's been building up inside of me
Tonight we'll go and paint this town
We're gonna drink champagne, till we both fall down
And we'll find some other crazy dream tomorrow

Gypsy,
I did not mean to suggest that that was the case, only that it could be the case. When I was younger, I used to confuse some of my dreams as other people with dreams of past lives. I do occassionally dream of past lives, but it is often difficult to tell which are mine and which belong to others. Sometimes I will have a reccuring dream where from things around me I can determine what era the dream took place in. It is one of the reasons I am so interested in history. I have often had two reccuring dreams from the same time era where I am two different people. These are possibly ancestrial memories, or one might be a past life and the other be someone elses, an ancestrial memory, or something else.
It is important if you want to understand your dreams that you record them as soon as you wake up. You should be as detailed as you possibly can be. colors, scents, patterns, textures, and everything else you noticed in the dream should be recorded.
After a you have the same dream twice, compare the two records of the dream for differences. those differences though seemingly insignificant might signal something significant. A past life dream will usually grow in detail the more often you have the dream. So will a dream of someone else.
For many years I have had a dream where I am a soldier in the Vietnam/American war. My name is Samuel James Evans, and I am from New Jersey. I am carrying a knife in my hand and am running from people who had captured me, but I had escaped from. As I am running I am having thoughts of a girl with long straight dark hair who seems to be my girlfriend (or I think so anyway) It seems as if we had fought via letters and I am certain that I will die without ever getting to tell her that I Love her.
I end up getting shot in the back and die thinking about how much I wanted to spend my life with her.
After years of having that dream I finally realized that I was not Samuel James Evans, but that he had contacted me when he died in Vietnam. I have had the dream since I was a small child. Samuel was a real soldier in Vietnam and he really did get killed in action and he was from New Jersey. I think that he can not rest until that girl knows that he died thinking of her and that he loved her.
Since I have never actually heard him think of her name, I do not know it. That makes tracking her down very difficult.
I have gotten way off subject, but please Gypsy, record your dreams.

I often have dreams in which I am other people...sometimes I seem myself...perhaps in a past or future life ..etc..other times I am more of the observer acting out the part of a character in a dream-story...like a movie..and I know the plot already..and it is just a matter of saying my lines..(still working on the rolling credits at the end though ) *smiling at all the above posts* ZZzZzZzZz~

Dreams of animals..being animals..talking with animals... I once dreamed I was swimming through some rapids..from one beach to the other...and when I came to the other side..there were three figures crouching down in the sands...and they seemed to be ..I think they were Coast Salish..(First Nations group from B.C.)..they were prepairing some food at the fire..and I walked up to them..with the wet sands..I can remember the way they felt as they clung to my legs..in between my toes..(isn't it funny how the details can be so clear in our minds sometimes)..I walked up to them..there was one man and two women..and I started to speak to them..asking them what kind of journey I was on...but when I looked closer I realised that the man..who was now facing me..had no ears...I looked to one of the women..and realised she had no eyes..and to the other woman..only to find her form was in a shadow..and I could not tell even if she had a face. But they spoke after I had..only they didn't speak as such. And their words were foreign to me..yet I knew them. And their voices were one ...and it was an amazing song they sung..And then all of a sudden they rose to their feet and like mice scampered away...and I was left standing looking at the fire..and their words still clung in the air as I stood there watching the rapids rush by beach's edge. I could feel something swooping down now..and I could see a shadow cross the sands..I looked to the air and there was a massive bird...it seemed part Raven, part Eagle..Now I was being lifted into the sky..climbing high into the clouds above the pines..caught up in the golden talons of this great bird. And then I found myself in an enormous nest..made from woven branches..I can't remember much else..other than falling asleep there.

Monadh-As always, your dreams (the ones you share with us here)are positivly Fragrant!
Your most recent sharing moved me almost as much as your dream of the White House(this time you were the white mouse) ; )
I have not had a dream to share for some time and now that I do it seems to (in the typical synchronistic way of things) echo Caolites' post
Crazy Dreams.

I am going somewhere -I have a destination but it's not an appointment- I find myself (a pedestrian)perplexed time and time again by helpful persons suggesting it is unsafe to be walking in the median or on the on ramp to the freeway ect. ect. Every time I am warned I realize there is danger yet feel only puzzlement.
I continue to find myself in pedestrian unfriendly situations-the scent of carbon monoxide and oily asphalt begins to intrude.
I am on a (bridge?)looking down on a snow covered
dell-My dog is snoofing around down there as doggies do.I whistle and call but he pretends not to hear(he's having too much fun)so I make my way down the hill to him-just as I am about to reach him I sink through the snow into the fast moving river below.My first thought is-in the movies people survive this but in reality I will freeze and sink in less than 2 minutes.My second thought
is -yelling couldn't hurt!Too bad I can't make a sound 'cause i'm already frozen. As I pass below the bridge I see a person -so far away -I try and
wave for help -silly-I can't move my arms and now it's so quiet.
Am crossing the bridge, the air is full of spring.
There are folks camped out by the riverside.The picnic tables are full but room is made for me.Someone hands me a chili dog.all eyes are on the movie screen -a rescue drama!Rescue workers have pulled a woman from the frozen river.
Tense moments-She lives!interviews with family and friends-the survivor .Pics of her as a teen-
bios-."I was really cold,and scared"-Cover of u.s.a. today.
It was time to move on..I said "It's nice when things turn out so well"
No one answered.I picked up my backpack and headed off.

Longwinded? Never!
Love to all

I almost never remember my dreams. Probably a good thing too...lol

I have been having dreams within dreams for the past few days...ones in which you find yourself waking in your sleep..only to find you are still dreaming..like layers of reality...The full moon always has an effect on my dreamstates. Ivy...positively incredible dream! Such a sequence of movement....Celt...many people can't remember their dreams..or they seem to fade away into a fuzzy memory..I have had times where I couldn't remember a dream for long phases of time..but that is not to say the dreams aren't there eh? Perhaps it is the ones we can't remember which we don't really need to....)Hops, Chamomile, Wild Lettuce, Passionflower, Valerian, Mistletoe..all are very helpful for both getting a good sleep..and exploring dreamworlds, I find..then again..so is Oatmeal(yes..oatmeal! *L*)..and a lot of other wonderful things *g*

Sailing along, through the foggy night
I cannot see a thing
My compass points the way that is right
8 bells begins to ring
A little bird flies down
From the mast high above
Its feathers are yellow and brown
I look for the cliffs
With the lofty green meadows
Where the birds do endlessly sing
And the cottage with wispy
White clouds from the chimney,
Tells me she's keeping our bed warm for me
And soon I will be in the arms of my lover
Not a wink will we sleep the night through
The princess will hold her ruddy faced rover
In my eyes she will gaze with a love that's so true
A look that is saved just for lovers
The look from the eyes of my bonnie sweet lady
That keeps on bringing me home
To my beautiful princess that I love oh so dearly
From the world that I'm destined to roam

I had one of my recurring dreams again last night. It is so vivid in detail that I thought I would share it. I am with a friend in Turkey. we are staying at a hotel, the accomodations are incredibly bad. My friend, (a guy in his early twenties) comes running into the room and tells me grab my bag we've got to go. as we leave the hotel, Turkish police/maybe military men begin to chase us. some on foot and some in 1950's style vehicles. We keep running until we lose them and we duck into a store that we had been to before.
The woman whose husband owns the store brings out a young child and tells me heres your baby, you two are in a lot of trouble, you can not stay. We take off running again, although I still do not know why, or from who. I am carrying the child on my hip as I run.
We cross some railroad tracks and start to cross a road. A limo driving down the road stops, and Dwight D. Eisenhower pokes his head out of the window. He tells the driver to let us get into the car, but as I am handing him the child, guns fire and I am shot down. The man that I am with, gets in the car after much prodding from the occupants that nobody can help me. The oddest thing is, they tell him, "She is already dead."
I attribute this dream to being another troubled soul's last memory, because I have never been to Turkey, I am a man, and I am not old enough to remember President Eisenhower. I think that the companion of the lady, that I was in the body of, was either her husband or boyfriend, but none the less, the father of the child. I also think that there was a family connection between the President and him.
I have had this dream numerous times during my life, and I never want to wake from it, because I do not want to leave the lady alone in her dying moments. The thought of dying does not seem to bother her as much as the thought of her being abandoned by the man. She seems to think that he will probably place the child in an orphanage to cover his affair with her.
These dreams I am certain are the real life tales of those who can not pass over until the truth they could not convey in life is told.

i agree Daryl. try to find out if this dream has any truth in it. someone's soul is trying to tell their story through you.

What I would give to have a dream again. My Dragon is overseas, my dragonfly has been waking up throughout the night for some reason....

I do love to dream, good or bad, just let me dream and go to a land that is not here. Let me sort my thoughts and feelings in the most unconventional of ways. Colors, sounds....Since this Dream Journal started, I tried writing my dreams down. Having a 20 month old kinda puts a kink in the writing down part. *yawn* It's late...I'm off to dream. *hums Dream Weaver as she crawls into bed*.

I continue to swirl through forein lands..wandering through the misty nights..finding myself amoungst the rainbow sands of time and tide...
Wonderful posts folks *s*
*~Sweetest dreams~*

Hello all!
10 days since the last post.I do hope we are not done!
I havn't remembered any dreams of late.......
To continue dialogue however-Have any of you seen the film "The Navigator" ?
Tis' dreamy to me,and confusing as such.
Love and Dream Retention to you all ,Esp.Graymyst

My (silly) dreams of late...
One night I was a creature crawling around in a wall..that was fun...well odd anyway.
Another night I had one of those dreams in which I wake to find myself back in an old bedroom..and me wondering to myself..self,what am I doing back here again?Same old ceiling I am looking up at..walls..window..door..etc...yet so much has changed..why am I back in this old dusty memory?And so I soon find myself leaving that old home...out the front door and down the street I go..how many times have I rambled down these city sidewalks?..reaching out to pick the cherry blossoms on my way..tearing the leaves from the branches with such indifference
here I am in an old dream..running around in old memories..and there up ahead..I can see the crowds of spectators to a baseball game just starting at the park..sweet old sounds and memories...I love that old street.
Just this morning I was dreaming I was in some little villa..surrounded by folks in brightly coloured costumes..and why were we celebrating? There was an army on it's way to greet us..yet we are all so jovial...? Perhaps we plan on fighting bullets with music and smiles?
But then just before I awoke..the army started marching in..and now another one came from a different direction..but this one was here to defend us..now suddenly caught in the crossfire...and I am watching as the battle ensues...then I woke up..beautiful sunny morning here..no silly wars or games..just me snug as a bug in my bed.
Lately I have been having a lot of dreams where I find myself entering the dream in the form of waking up..and finding myself in the dream..sometimes..if it is not a pleasant place to be..I try waking and waking ,again and again in my dream..but it never seems to work..I just find myself somehow stuck there until I play out the scene.
And then there is one of my favourite aspects of dreaming..the ability to be suddenly transported at will to any location ...(providing I'm not stuck in the above situation) I can feeely go where I want...with just a thought I can transport matter..just a twitch of my nose and a click of my heels...and away I fly to wherever takes my fancy.
So many dreams in one night..hard to remember half of them sometimes..I always remember the silly bits lately.(like my dream the night before last, where I was watching a political debate..and I knew one of the people in the running...
Or the one a couple of weeks ago where I was packing my bags and moving to China(I kept saying aloud in my dream 'but why am I moving to China?)
In another part of the same dream I was telling people to stay out of the forest cause the local enviro. group had gone militant..and they were threatening to shoot anyone who so much as entered the woods...*L* oie oie oie..what a jumble of a messy dreams..
I have had some more serious dreams .. I swear...*ZZzzzZZz~

p.s.
haven't seen that film I don't think Ivy.
Who's in it?What's it 'bout?

The wind had abandoned us
We waited in vain
For a breeze to blow our ship homeward
I lay on the deck
The warm sun making
Me doze, and dream of your sweet bonnie face
I feel your warm lips
On my own as thrills race
Up my keel and straight to my ticker
The dream is so real
And I'm starting to feel
I'm with you in the flesh
Growing thicker
And you love me the way
Last you did on the day
That we parted and I went away
And soon we will be
Holding on tight
Forever, our love burning bright

Drifting along on this sea of dreams
My lover is by my side
We're safe over an inner harbor we are
Safe in a tower so high
Where the world is shut out and
Our dreams have come true
I whisper the words in her ear
That tells her I love her
And want her
And need her
Forever
My love,
My love oh so dear

ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh .. she's active ... *sigh*

Inland we go
Fields of wheat lie below
An alien scene to be sure
But the mission is steady
And we are both ready
For the lovers sweet rendezvous
So far from the sea
She'll cling on to me
So safe and so loved in my arms
In a fortress we'll stay
For many a day
Til the mission has run its full course

'ello .. 'ello ... now, where's ya buccaneers ...'under ya buccaanhat' *nuck .. nuck .. nuck*

sorry ... couldn't resist .. I am sure someone else could have said it better .. but ..............

Dreams of lacie walking the plank...

can someone help me understand this dream: the prayer group leader at my school asks me to celebrate a Wiccan holiday for the group so they can see that the Craft isn't evil. i invite all my Witch friends plus my Christian friend Morrighan. we do the whole rite together. at one point we grab people of other beliefs and hand them a flame. i grab this annoying Bible Thumper from math. he takes the flame and starts to juggle with it. we Witches and Morrighan reliece the magick circle by saying "the circle is open but never broken." a man from the prayer group stands up, pulls out a magick knife, cuts his wrist, says "you're wrong the circle is broken" and pours his blood on the ground. the man then disappears in black smoke.

hmmmmmmmm.........

Do you know the man?

LMAO @ Dominiqueyou .. so THAT is where that nightmare of mine came from *smile* .. you have very strong powers!!

Gwench .. be careful.

*wanders off the plank into the dark water ......................................*

GW,

From a global Mythological/folklore standpoint, the Myan and Incan Royalty would pour their blood onto small strips of cloth and burn the cloth as a sacrifice for the good of their people. They would usually pierce either their tongue or their Member (if they were male) to draw blood from. The latter being the usual choice, as it represents the greatest amount of sacrifice. Cutting the wrist is associated with suicide, which is also a form of self sacrifice.

You are being asked to perform a ritual to aid in the understanding of your religion to others around you, in the dream. At the completion of the ritual a man gets up and basically undermines what you have done, by way of a sacrifice.

Perhaps you have been trying to show someone near to you the truth about the old ways, and you are concerned that in this pivotal period, the work you have done can still be undone by another.

Likely it is another who follows the old ways, but with darker intent or for the wrong reasons. (You know what I mean) The only way to counter the effects of a sacrifice, is to offer a purer sacrifice.

I do not expect that anyone will be spilling blood literally, but it might be wise to sacrifice more than a little bit of time to show another a sample of what you believe. You must show them the reason you believe as you do.

GW....or maybe you are being led to abandon what you are doing and follow a truer path.

*throws lace a life-vest*....'Youuuuu oooookkkaaayyyy ddoooooowwwwwnnn tttthhheeeerrre?
*raising concerned eyebrow*...HEY!!! no planking allowed folks!!! *L*
~*~
G'wench,..very interesting dream...The sharing of beliefs..the passing of a flame...the spilling of blood...
It would seem that in this dream the rite in question was a Sabbat which you were asked to perform in order to help show others the true nature of the Wiccan path....and that the man who lets his blood is in fact as Daryl suggested carrying out some sort of sacrifice. The question which remains in my mind is..who was the man..and why did he carry out such an act at that particular moment in the ritual..Perhaps he was another part of yourself,..a reflection if you will....he could in fact be symbolizing the death of an aspect in your life...the spilling of blood in turn representing the shedding of a skin...a letting go if you will.You said he cut his wrist with a magic knife...an athame, and an athame is commonly associated with the element of fire and it is often interchangable with the sword ... The fact that he fades into a smoke is very significant for that would represent a transformation...black smoke has it's own special meaning as well. I suppose I could read a lot of different meanings into this particular dream..but true observance must come from within you as it was your dream afterall. Wicca is first and foremost a nature-based faith. The elements, the seasons, play a fundamental role in the Wiccan belief system.It is through the process of change that a continuation is insured, in order for there to be life there must be a death, and in turn a rebirth.. Indeed the themes of sacrifice, death, and rebirth play key roles in the Wiccan path, as well as most of the world's other religions. . The female aspect is one that, whilst being seasonal as the Earth and the Moon...is ever-present. She is the Goddess, (Artemis, Astare, Athene, Dione, Aphrodite, Arianrhod, Isis, Bride, Cerridwen, Dana, ,Melusine, Persephone, etc.)..whereas the male aspect is one which must constantly be dying , and of course be reborn..resurrected....(Baldur, Tammuz, Dionysos, and yes even Christ to mention just a few ) .He is the god of the waxing year (the Oak King), as well as the god of the waning year (the Holly King).. the twins of light and dark..who'm together form the dance of good and evil...ying and yang.Together he is the 'Horned God' Cernunnos.It is through such representations in myths and legends of the dualistc forces of nature that we find understanding of our environment , thus giving names to the aspects of the entity we call Nature, the Divinity which indwells and encompasses all in this great Universe of ours.
~*~(A bit about wiccan rituals....)~*~
In a 'working partnership' style coven there is commonly a High Priestess (prima inter pares), a High Priest, a Maiden (assistant to the High Priestess, though this role tends to vary with different schools of practice),..I would assume ..Gypsywench.. that since you were the one who was asked to carry out this rite that you were in fact either the High Priestess or the Maiden. There are many different rites, and for each there are certain guidelines one should follow according to whatever source one is drawing from for guidance. With any rite there should be an Invocation and a Banishment, (save in the case of certain rites such as that of Hagiel..in which the Lords of the Watchtowers.. are not summoned therefore need no release).In a common Gardnerian/Alexandrian type of Opening Ritual..the Invocation.. the High Priestess calls on three members (who are typically female,but that of course can vary as well)of the circle to establish the elements...to each of whom the following is given, and then placed again at the altar by that person after he she/he walks deosil from North to North - first witch :Water (bowl of water consecrated at the beginning of the invocation by the High Priestess and the High Priest.) -second witch : Air (incense),-and third witch : Fire (one of the four altar candles, lanterns, or torches) This is then proceeded by the High Priestess drawing the Invoking Petagram of the Earth with her athame. This same movement is then enacted by the High Priest and the rest of the coven...followed by the summoning of the Lords of the Watchtowers and the High Priest drawing down the Moon..which involves the fivefold kiss. The Charge is now given.This is then the typical moment for consecrating the wine (or whatever your substituion may be) and cakes/buiscuits...which are handed out among the circle..(mind one should leave some cake to put out for the wee folk later) After Invocation, the Great Rite (won't go into too much detail on that right now seeing as how I am already over-staying my post's welcome), and whatever other ritual is being incorporated...(i.e. a specific Sabbat, or Esbat ..).....there must be a banishment which generally involves the drawing of the Banishing Petagram with the athame.
~*~
The reason I just walked through some of the basics of a common Wiccan ritual is for the benefit of those who might otherwise not have had the occasion to read into before, or for those who are revisitiung the subject... as well as to point out some of the fundamental points which are especially significant in such a ceremony, (ie. the use of athames or other such ceremonial knives or swords in a Wiccan ceremony, and the summoning of the elemental powers). The rituals differ from coven to coven naturally, and some may find that the above mentioned may not desribe well at all what occurs in their own rites, however I do feel that there are certain basic rites and priciples which most witches would agree upon. Whatever your faith..I hope it brings you closer to yourself..and in turn the Divinity therein.
Well that was a load of garble on my part eh?..Gotta contribute somehow *g*
zZzZzZzZ~*~Many sweet dreams y'all *s* ZzZzZzZz

*comes up spluttering* .. thanks, mona .. *hug*

Monadh,

It is always a welcome sight to see instructions on various rites. Most of what I know I learned through dreams or the dregs of memories from older folk in my family who were gone long before I came of age.
I find it fascinating to know that most of what I dream / remember is so close to the practical application of the craft. As I have said before, I am often contacted by the Spirits of the departed, and I think that they teach me alot. No amount of learning is ever to much. Although I must add a Limerick to point out the fact that I do not subscribe to the theory that all knowledge is good...

I used to think all knowledge was good
And if learning could be done I would
Until an unwanted teacher did impart
A lesson in the smell of a horrendous fart
That knocked over everything that stood

Just a little humor to lighten the mood in the room. *s*

you are right about it being a Sabbat. i think it was Beltain in the dream. the man that shed his blood is a warlock ( an evil witch for those out of the wiccan loop). i know this because i've seen him in live from a far. (i have the gift to see if someone is good or evil.) what bafles me is Morrighan helping me with the rite. she's a Christian but she has done magick in the past.

The Torah speaks of a witch helping King Saul speak to Samuel after Samuel's death, so it seems completely natural to me that a disciple of Yahweh's son would help a witch. In relationship to the dream, it is likely, especially if the lady with the name of one of the most powerful Irish Triple Goddesses, is a close friend, that you were calling on friends that you knew you could trust to assist you.

I open my eyes,not sure I'm awake or asleep, twilight is upon me, the stars look unfamiliar, but you are there with me, and I am calm. Your love overwhelms me, I sigh with contentment, we are one for many hours, I am safe and warm knowing you love me and I love you.

As I have said before, sometimes my dreams are the inspiration for my poetry. If anyone has ever had a dream in which they shift into animal form, you will appreciate the poem at the link below. I would simply post it hear, but I think that the background (Drawn by my eldest son) helps set the mood. This is based off of several dreams that I had, and on at least one next morning discovery of a bloody face after having such a dream the previous night. Just a dream???http://home.talkcity.com/StudioRow/fileannasaoirse/Under_The_Waning_Moon.htm

it's X-mas. i'm in the local church play. a man graps my wrist hard and flings me against the wall. confused i ask him his name. he calls himself Steve, i pannic. i know him it's mom's ex-boyfriend the murderer. i pull out a knife i tucked in my dress. he lets go of me. i run down the row of pews yelling "murderer". a friend calls the police and they arrest Steve.------------what could this nightmare mean? someone please help me understand it.

Whoever Steve is or whoever he represents is a person that you don't trust. He was captured in the dream, so this would indicate some closure.

Out of curiousity, is Steve, the same man from the previous dream? Think hard, people might look different from one dream to the next, as our minds represent different aspects of a person, so do not be fooled by the fact that the two men may not look alike. Ask yourself the question while meditating, are these two men the same person. then allow your mind to wander where it will so that it might come back with the answer. Once we know the answer to this question, then we might be able to proceed with the meaning of the dream (s).

I have a feeling that this dream is tied to your previous one where also a man was in a place of religous significance attempting to disrupt a ceremony. Christmas Plays are one of the Rituals carried out at Christmas time. It therefore is very similar in structure to your previous dream.

Once again we see the intervention by way of a knife. In the end, a man has disrupted the ceremony and then is taken away. Last time in a puff of Black Smoke, this time, by Police. It is interesting that this time you hold the knife, and by timely recognition of him and his probable ill-intent, you are able to prevent him from making his sacrifice to completely undo the Ceremony.

Christmas is tied strongly to Winter Solice which was a time of sharing and of new beginnings. This came from the Early Church placing religous holidays to coincide with Festivals already known. Allowing its members to still take part in celebrations and remain in the way of the Church.

BTW, have you started keeping a journal of your dreams, yet?

If I am right, and these dreams are related, you might be having others that fill in the gaps that are missing in these two dreams. The two dreams are only six days apart. I have had dream series that have lasted a fortnight or longer, as my Spirit sought an answer to a problem, or spoke with the Spirit of another who had recently parted from its mortal shell.

Dreaming of betrayal
From a loving spouse
Two people go their ways
And they sell their house

A lifetime of dreams go up in smoke
Yet things get stranger, then
For the two are at the altar
To try it once again

Here they are once more
They're buying back their house
But someone stole the doors
And now there's no way in the house

i came to the same conclution about the warlock and Steve(that they're one and the same). Dave, Steve is a convited murderer, thus a reason for me not to trust him.

How have you been getting along in your dream world lately? Anymore ceremonies ruined by the Gadaí na Taibhreamh?

Reading back over my last couple of posts, I realised I made a couple of blunders. I massacred the spelling of Solstice, and in attempting to use Gaeilge for Dream thief, I might have offended someone.

I knew an old lady once who told me about a way for a spirit (of a human or otherwise) to enter someone elses dream and change it for their own amusement. She called such a spirit a dream thief.

I am wondering if this might be what is happening with you, Gypsy. If so you might try using a dream catcher the way they were intended to be used (as opposed to a rearview mirror ornament which I see many people doing).

Take one, preferably hand made by you or someone close to you, and hang it over your bed directly over the spot where you normally sleep. If some other spirit has been attempting to enter your dreams, this is supposed to stop them. I have not personally used this technique, but I have been told by people who have, that it is effective.

BTW do not allow a person who you think might be attempting dream thievery sp??? to see the dream catcher. It has been said that they can be used against you if an unscrupulous person were to behold it and you at the same time. But then again, you would not want someone like that in view of your bed anyway.

Gypsy,
I need to ask you a question. send me an e-mail.

Indeed dreamcatchers are fun to make and they can be really helpful in warding off nightmares etc....
I find that Eagle or Raven feathers are the most powerful, but of course mostly anything will do..likewise, certain colours, and materials used for the threading to make the web, as well as the material the frame is made out of can also affect the integrity of the catcher...

Does anybody know how they made their way from hanging over beds to hanging over dash boards? Perhaps that is for drivers who fall asleep behind the wheel??? *ROTF*

psychics (sP) were giving away advice saying to hang a crystal from your rearview mirrow, and that would make your driving safer.

wonders if people aren't going just a bit overboard with this dream thing...um, aren't dreams supposedly mostly just chemical firings going off in the brain? Wish fulfillment and all that? How does a feather manage to "catch" a dream? I guess it's just being there could provide some comfort, if the sleeper believes that it might help, but that would be a placebo effect....hmmmm....Jest askin'... ;)

Dreams are much more than chemical firings going off in the brain. Usually they help you to deal with problems you are having in your own life, and offer you glimpses of possible future senarios resulting from current events. Other times they do provide uncanny glimpses of future events or of current events that the dreamer could not possibly have any clue about.

When I was a teenager, I had a dream that my parents car caught on fire under the back seat and it caused the car to explode killing everyone in my family except me. I told my parents about the dream at breakfast. We were taking a trip that day, and the car caught on fire. My Father was able to get the back seat out and with the help of some men passing by, they were able to put out the fire that had been caused by the muffler overheating boxes of matches that the previous owner of the car had allowed to slip under the back seat.

Had it not been for the dream, my family would likely have died that day because we later discovered that we had a leak in the fuel line that ran right under the seat.

I could give countless other examples from myself and many others that prove dreams are more than random neuron firings. Most scientists that research dreams do not hold that theory anymore.

Anyway, I guess I should get down off of my soap box now.

Well *s*...
I don't know..but personally I have always thought it an interesting subject...to study one's dreams...Who has not on at least occassion..woken up and just felt like telling the story of their latest dream with others..through whatever form of communication....
In regards to dreamcatchers...well every culture has it's belief systems...what may look simply to be a cross to one person for instance..could hold such deeper meanings to another...thus a feather could seem merely a feather to one, yet something entirely sacred and holy to another..., likewise with many other examples...
What I mean to say is that while certain beliefs or traditions which are important to one may seem foreign, odd, or different from another's perspective...
Many of the creation stories of the First Nations of North America involved Ravens and Eagles for instance....thus their significance to many.
http://www.moa.ubc.ca/Exhibitions/Permanent/rotunda/rotundaview.html
http://www.seanet.com/~eldrbarry/rabb/rvn/reid.htm

....that first link should (hopefully) lead to a page showcasing the work of Haida artist Bill Reid (may he rest in peace), the picture in the middle being a magnificent depiction of the Haida creation story..
second link --- this site also has a bit of background information concerning the work as well as a larger scale picture )

We could say that everything we sense, feel, or believe is ultimately just chemical reactions and what-not occuring in our central nervous system...and perhaps and most probably it is just that...
What makes our existance, and feeds us such fine dreams and visions which illuminate the paths of our lives..How we interpret our surroundings through expression...However one relates to their dreams in the faith or religious path they might follow..I think it is important to remember that it is our varied tapestry of spiritual conceptions and beliefs that bring such diverse,harmonious wealth to humankind..(in this, our modern world of shrinking biological and cultural diversity)....
I remember a story a lovely Cree lady told me once, about the significance of dreamcatchers to her in her spirituality..and the importance to her that continuing the tradition of making dreamcatcher's held for her.....such a pity I can't remember the exact words she used.. to share with all of you what it was she expressed..
My dreams have all been far too crazy to mention of late so I'll spare ya *s* ~*ramble ramble ramble~

I have to agree with you, Monadh. The dream catcher is a part of certain cultural groups belief structure and as such are as sacred as a cross to a Christian, the Star of David to a Jewish person or a Pentagram to a Wiccan. I think that the thing that bothers me about them being displayed on rear view mirrors, is that it seems as if we are taking something that is sacred to a group of people that was created for a very noble purpose, and misusing it. The consequences of such an action can never be anything good. If you misuse a sacred symbol, it can be misused against you.

I might come off a bit flipant at times, but this message needs to be made clear to all. Do not misuse sacred symbols. And if you do not understand something, using it can be dangerous.

*Once again looking below my feet discovering that darn soap box is there again*

*Agrees with Celt*

Putting away all of the soap boxes, and locking them up. If people think the contributors to this area are getting carried away, why take the time to read all the way to the bottom?

Speaking of which, I think it is time to break this off and begin another column It is getting rather lengthy Acc, could you work some magic and make a new conversation appear directly after this one, Dreams III perhaps, please please, please? *begs like child*

until then, follow this link to the new room

http://www.alia.ie/tir/discus/messages/2/382.html?ThursdayJune720010530pm